Here you go, weapon resting and bipods, plus much more:
http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=21785
Down please downvote this "cupholder" suggestion and look over and vote on the rest of the ones on this list?
Here you go, weapon resting and bipods, plus much more:
http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=21785
Down please downvote this "cupholder" suggestion and look over and vote on the rest of the ones on this list?
Just bought this game at retail and proceeded to install, make a quick scenario to practice sniping, chose a rifle with a bipod, lay prone to set up for a shot... and thought to myself "woops, I must not have paid attention to the keybind for using a bipod". Turns out, *there ISN'T one*. Oh, honestly devs. This is the Number 1 upvoted issue here, and has been requested since March. I read through the patch notes today, and it's still conspicuously unattended to. GIT ER DONE!
I understand a lot ... But why BI can not be said about the bipod at least something. Complete nonsense. 2200 testers want this simple product. Tell me "no" or "yes" (when?).
There are multiple expansions properly implementing weapon-resting and bipods - it can't be that difficult to do.
Biped weapons would be really useful at some circumtances, upvoted.
Noticed in the new update that lying down with high zoom optics (SOS for example) has a newly introduced effect which is a rather hard short sway that happens now and then. A part from the vibrations (which I like) this new one is not good for bipod weapons as it comes and goes and makes shots completely miss. And this is on top of the *still* traveling effect where the weapon moves at all times back and forth slowly.
When lying down with bipod weapons the traveling should be gone. The weapon is resting on the ground so it doesn't travel around. Small vibrations and minor variations are ok, but not traveling and hard "knicks". Weapons without bipods can have all these things - im all for that.
You feel like a rather crappy sniper still when you cant have the aim not traveling while lying down. If BIS can animate the bipods - great, but I don't even care as long as the effect is simulated.
Please, make bipod weapons not travel when lying down, and if you can get someone on it please animate the bipods when we lie down. ;)
BI. BIPOD. Please. Thanks.
Won't be touching this game again until bipods are in. Wake me up then guys (no homo)
This NEEDS to be assigned, built, and completed.
It's 2013. Mainstream shooters like battlefield have bipods and resting. Games built off of this very engine have bipod functionality.
Is it simply too hard to ask for a way to increase accuracy and reduce sway? Using Shift+B/H/Space to deploy a bipod is surely very simple.
Sure the ACE guys could make it, but why should they have to? How many more ARMA games will there be without bipods or rested shooting?
It's pathetic that this is still an issue.
Granted Wallside a Bipod weapon is not completely lacking the sway, however it is drastically reduced in comparison to holding your rifle. Even resting your weapon drastically decreases sway. I am just saying that while not entirely eliminated it would be very low in comparison unless you just don't know how to use the thing.
"A bipod weapon should be able to be put down and aimed at something and stay there."
This is not how bipods work. You are still holding the stock, the weapon is not fixed.
So, as we have the full game released already, I can only state how disappointed I am with the way BIS handled feedback.
This issue has been marked important by over 2100 people. In the ArmA community this is an awful lot. Other major issues like the inability to fire out of vehicles have also received no developer feedback at all.
Are we only good for finding bugs in Bohemia Interactive's eyes? Almost every ticket that is not a straight bug report but provided feedback about features that are absolutely necessary in the game has been ignored completely.
I commented before but need to do it again. There are mods which is great, and they are very welcomed.
But, BIS need to fix the weapons that currently have bipods and remove the damn traversing effect. It bugs me to no end. When we lie down at least with bipod weapons it should be no traversing effect. Only the vibrations that come and go as they are realistic.
I cant believe this is so hard to do. Sniping feels completely off as you have to take opportunistic shots when the sway floats over an enemy, and that is very very hard when doing long shots - as snipers do. A bipod weapon should be able to be put down and aimed at something and stay there.
Please BIS do something about this.
+1
This really should have been implemented years ago really... Now being 2013/Arma3 there is no excuse to not have this function in the game! If your not going to have the function in the game then WHY even have bipods on weapons at all?
All those high voted issues, only the CPU/GPU Utilization one they actually made great improving on it, and that is maybe the most tough one.
But why don't BIS you get some time and take care of those easyer stuffs, just something already been done in VBS or ArmA2Mods
what is needed is a core implementation and not just a third-party addon; because lots of server don't allow mods and addon.
Ok, everybody. For now, there is a mod called "Tao Modular Realism" that allows you to rest your weapon on surfaces, and deploy bipod on guns that have them.
Download that, and let's hope we won't need that soon.
Engine realization absolutely needed. Otherwise animations and changing pivot point from playe torso to resting point will not be possible.
This mods is just are small and temporary suggestions. In-engine system must be much wider. For example, we need iron sight mode but also we need ability to blind shooting. MG always work like this. It's drasticly change gameplay.
Agreed with Cyrilator, this as a core feature is well overdue.. However as addons go, @VTS_Weaponresting also works pretty well.
There are bipods on some weapons, but you can't deploy them. Could do this pretty simply in America's Army, and is quite useful for long range shots.
(In AA, if you were prone and your weapon had a bipod, pressing 'G' would deploy it. Otherwise, 'G' was usually used to switch to an under-barrel grenade launcher, if equipped)
Wanted to share an experience I had last night on Altis playing BE Warfare which made me aware of this well known feature request.
I've seen plenty of posts and topics on bipods and resting weapons from a window but I never realized how important this feature is. Last night on Altis I was assaulting a powerplant filled w/AI. I found a neighborhood with an overwatch to the plant and it also happened to be the high ground. I hid my IFRIT in the neighborhood and positioned all of my ai in the houses on the 2nd floor looking outside the windows. I took position and tried to look out the window with my scope, kneeling as much as I could. The targets were about 400-500m out and I had a great ambush setup. I began the ambush and then realized that my weapon sway was going to be a big problem. Because I couldn't take advantage of resting my rifle on the window I was all over the place with my shots. We ended up getting annihilated, but after that engagement I realized what a detriment it is to not have the ability to rest your rifle on objects like a window. This feature seems a lot more important now with Altis in the mix. It has so many buildings that are open inside, making this feature a lot more important then ever before.
I hope it gets developed in the near future.
It would be great
The latest patch while lying down with bipod mounted weapons traverse all over the landscape. Really annoying. I love the new vibration in the scope when zoomed in max that occurs now and then.
I remember that from when I used a long range scope on a weapon, and when touching the weapon here and there while aiming small vibrations happen. Super duper done by BIS, but the aim moving slowly back and forth all over needs to go.
And please get those bipods animated when lying down.
Can we use bipods now?
Are you sure for the Realistic Wounding System?
I really hope that BIS won't have the same succes with DayZ or Take on Mars to revaluate priorities on Arma, it's their and our history with OFP. They need more devs and the release is too early with a lack of content and features. It's sad that they don't enough listen to us on the most wanted features. I don't know what's happen and what it will be in the future even if they do a good job.
BI should pay freelance mod developers for making their buggy games playable.
Are any devs or mods even going to make a comment on this? The ArmA community has been asking for something so simple for 6 years and continue to get brushed off and shit on by BI, and yet we hang around politely and keep asking and making the same recommendations over and over again like fools. This isnt a "feedback" tracker, this is just a bug tracker for a shitty unfinished game, the votes are like that of a fake democracy just there to make you feel like you have some say in it, but we don't, we have to wait for mods to finish these idiots game.
I like what I hear about this but I cant help but be sceptical until I see the some proof. Are you just being sarcastic or how do you know that all the highest voted features will come out as DLC's, if at all?
Haha I do not think BI would become EA.....yet.
sarcastic
Vulcanexius
mhhhh not sure if sarcastic or knows sth I dont....
All hands up for this feature. I even made up my wife and all of my brothers and sisters do so!
But this feature is needed to be normal, with small angles of aiming (due to deployed weapon hardpoint and shooter's body position), and rotating relative to the hardpoint, not the ACE-style "world rotation relative to shooter".
Don't worry guys all the highest voted features on the Feedback Tracker will come out in separate 2 part feature DLC's!
this, and a proper hitbox for wounding.
can be done, must be done and put in the vanilla version. you cant have heavy weapons with relevant recoil and dont employ the most obvious way to ease this recoil. a bipod is the diference between a useful machingeunner and a wasteful bullet sprayer that wouldnt hit the wide side of a barn from upclose with his third bullet.
This must be implemented.
Bipods were implemented perfect in Red Orchestra 2.
I made a very short video just to show off the mg deployment system
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zs3RqWvQX_E
But I doubt we will get sth. like this.
@NathanRyan They have always been like that - even in Game some weapons have BiPods on them but they are simply for show.
I must say though, i would be VERY surprised if they don't implement weapon resting or bipods in some fashion.
BIS, please make ability to animate bipods for first
Sold proof that ARMA is dying, The Devs feel it is important to put in a HUD feature so streamers can be safe obviously for Wasteland but do not incorporate features REAL ARMA players have wanted since OFP. Seriously BI come on get with it I love you and all but realize that DayZ pretty much ruined ARMA and Wasteland will be next.
I would also like to see bipods useable/implemented. Being able to "rest" a bipod on something (the ground, the floor, a rock that has enough surface to take the bipod, a wall, a box, a table in a sniper's hide in a building etc) would be great. The intended effect should be to stabilize the fire to some degree. Stabilization should NOT be as good as that provided to a tripod mounted weapon but better than shooting with hands and arms alone in the prone or kneeling while leaning against something.
Players should be able to adjust the height of the bipods also once they are put down. This would allow more effective employment on different surfaces/different slope gradients.
I know that an M249 SAW can be fired pretty accurately at range using bipods as long as the gunner has a good tight hold and fires controlled bursts.
Since dust is implemented in Arma III, I would assume that firing from a bipod in the prone on a dirt surface (like a road or a dirt spot) would push up some dust/dirt during firing also as compared to firing from a vegetated area.
Semper Fi
AldoUSMC
What really grinds my gears is that BIS stated: "We are focussing on the infantry part of the war, therefore we wont implement many features for vehicles"
Yet they dont even implement the most basic system in combat: deploying a weapon.
@AmTheAgent - I see, that's a bit misleading.
So it doesn't look like this feature will be in the Q3 release as BIS are about to go into a code freeze and just bug fix. This doesn't surprise me as in software development a beta usually means that all the code is there but there are known bugs and addressing them is top priority.
That aside we can only hope BIS look at this, the #1 voted feature request, and implement and release it as one of the post launch updates.
Would suggesting that the team behind the ACE mod, who have already developed an implementation of this in Arma 2, work with BIS to officially include this in the game be a bad idea? Even if it is post launch.
Meh, I'm just hoping BIS have this as a surprise card up their sleeves and will blow us all away by showing they really listen to the Arma community and secretly developed this for inclusion in the Q3 release.
Yep, I don't deserve more like deploying machinegun on window or on any static walls, just need the machinegun which can be deployed on the ground matched with awesome animation when soldier is proving.
Anyone else notice that of the four weapons featured in this page http://www.arma3.com/features/weapons two of them are deployed using bipods. Does this means that BIS have actually thought about adding this is to the full game?
Well if it isn't implemented it's not the end of the world. ACE did a perfect job and I'm sure well get a mod just for that mechanic. Id rather see a better camouflage system as NordKitchen actually has contributed ideas for.
@NordKitchen Well - we are happy that you're happy - that is good for you. But really, laughting didn't made nobody any smarter. It rather looks silly :)
For myself I would prefer to laught off some funny things, but on here I'll still remain serious - as dev's might have a problem with specifying our feedback (ok im done)
You guys clearly didnt understand my sarcasm. 100 points for you;)
This is as much camouflage as you will get apart from hiding:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4934308/Arma%203/Bush_rework/Bushes_rework_old_1.jpg
But jeah - I am missing words to describe the people who didnt catch my sarcasm^^ That made ME laugh^^
@NordKindchen ArmA is the most realistic simulator ever because it lacks realistic armour simulation? You must be kidding me...
Could we atleast get a dev response on this issue? I know its 'reviewed', but have they changed their minds about its priority, or do they still plan on implementing it way down the line? The issue is obviously important enough to warrant an official response of some kind.
Thats some very good points their! I always found it a bit strange how much kick the MX SW has in the game, even when prone...
Camouflage is still important, thats why we seen Millions still being put into the development! But the problem of the camo inside ArmAIII still stands but shouldnt be mentioned here in a bi-pod disscussion...
I do think that weapon resting on anything (without bipod) would be messy and difficult to incorporate, and the micro-stances assist with firing from cover/buildings, but it should be common sense to add usable (and removable) bipods to sniper rifles and LMGs in a military sim like arma. Battlefield does it, source mods do it (Insurgency), I'm sure other games do it, and Arma would be the one game where it makes the most sense. Please add, for the love of God. Deploying the bipod can be in the action menu whenever the player is prone or in front of an object at the right height for deployment. In a sim, functionality comes before aesthetics.
Arma is the most realistic war simulator ever. Therefore they didnt implement something this unimportant as bipoding or a decent armor system.
Also since camouflage nowadays is not important anymore they refuse to work on the camouflage aspect of the game.
I really like that people stand out in the far.
Especially that lying down under bushes will never hide you because theres no bush that grows to the ground really is a great aspect of the game to me.
In the end I really like where this is going and I hope they will never introduce a working and well thought through vehicle armor system to the game.
GG BIS.
"NordKindchen"
"...Also since camouflage nowadays is not important anymore.."
This is probably one of the funniest/ignorant comments I have hears a very long time.
Thank you for the laughs!!!!! I almost pissed my self.
Most realistic sim ever???
It is a great game. But farm from the most realistic. The product they sell to the US Marine, now that is a far more realistic but still lacking...
High weight + small caliber = less kicking recoil.I my army service expirience RPK shoots a bit smoother that AK cause have higher weight,even undeployed.Also most smooth in shooting is an PKM,but it's not comfortable to shooting from stand pose(Hot barrel dissalow you to handle it like a rifle).Only non aiming pose.
For this game weights will be:
1)MX SW - around 3.7kg(Almost same as MX,MX is MAGPUL MASADA)+AMMO
2)MK200 - 4.5kg(KAC LMG IRL) + AMMO
3)Zafir - 6.5kg(NEGEV NG IRL) + 3kg ammo belt
It's heavy enough that recoil is insane, and accurate aiming impossible, without resting it when not prone. As other games, including RV3-based games and mods, have implemented weapon resting already, it will appear odd, to say the least, if RV4 in A3 doesn't have it.
Jupp, Really need this feature, not just Bipods as said before but also being able to rest a weapon on the side of a wall or tree.
I feel the best way to do this would be an automatic, if obj detected next to any side of the weapon then have a reduced sway, if bipod is active then reduced even more
Jupp, Action menu would be bad, its already cluttered enough as it is!
LMGs are not heavy weapons OMAC.
It's not squid, ACE has it done pretty well, other mods have started doing it over the past few years. Other games/mods outside of ArmA even have it.
In the action menu would be bad, all they need to do is bind it to a button, presto.
Scroll wheel, deploy bipod with nice animation would be the best scenario, as it simulates the slight amount of time to required to deploy bipods. Problem is, it wouldn't simulate simply resting your weapon on something which ACE did with Shift+Space pretty well.
I'd settle for something like Shift+Space but regardless ACE will have it, so not all is lost.
It would still be nice if ArmA implemented it themselves however.
Obviously upvoted
See here for some RL non-bipod MG resting:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZ2SWWDt8Wg
Other than purely suppressive fire, how could one effectively fire a similar heavy weapon while behind a wall or other barrier (or from guard tower) WITHOUT resting it on the wall?
@trooper226
There's always some people in every community that dislikes for fun. Or they don't even know what bipods is :P
-->You're not contributing to the discussion Anachortes.
Because here nothing to discuss. All ideas already on the papers. We all need resting. ^)
Not sure why anyone would downvote this, it's an important issue. Although it may not be as important as the awful AI, it's definitely as important as the GUI fixes for vehicles and such. Definitely needs to be implemented, games like Battlefield and Red Orchestra have this, there's no reason why ArmA shouldn't.
It'd be great if the vanilla game was worth playing rather than needing mods to make up for a lack of effort put in by the devs in the most important areas.
Making thing's look good is great and all, but it means nothing when thing's aren't functioning well.
I'd like to see usable bi-pods at least. It's hard to use anything that would require them in any stance aside from prone/sitting without them.
Really hope they add this feature... would be a major disappoint. BIS, we don't just want a pretty game, we want features... more options.
upvoted +1
Why is this the most voted on thing on this tracker when there are so many more gamebreaking issues like the press-A-to-win Missiles, simplistic Fire control in Vehicles, still rough AI and animation/model/design problems all over the place still?
-1 Instagoat,
This is the single most important issue for making this into a proper infantry simulator. I don't care about animation problems.
Weapon Resting is absolutely vital to realistically using weapons
To some people Insta the bipods are a bigger problem, missles/vehicles have always been a problem/likely always will be. They're a scenario dependant case.
Infantry is a pretty widespread case rather than scenario specific. I'd wager ~70% involve infantry, when simple things which should be in are not & thus create some difficulties/resentment in the community people get a little irked.
+1 InstaGoat, peoples should stop whinning about it and focus on bug tracking (yes there are still problems...), of course deploying a weapon is important and the development team knows why, no need to write pages to repeat the same thing over and over and over again. They're not stupid!
They said they'll not do it, ACE will probably implement it as well as a lot of other cool stuff, not a serious issue to me.
And can somebody tell me, why they don't want to implent it?!
Bipod use in Iron Front: Liberation 1944
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMIjwvyxOdM
If we have to use a mod to have weapon resting/bipod use in A3, I will be very, very disappointed. With intense recoil present in many weapons (too much in some cases), it is especially egregious that there is no way to steady your weapon other than going prone... ARGH!
Anachoretes can't you see beyond evidence ?
I take example with airsoft gun cause they have the SAME weight and dimensions profile and way to work, the ONLY difference between airsoft and real weapon is ONLY when you shoot, the way to use a bipod and the way it stabilize the weapon/airsoft replica is the SAME until you shoot, and the physic i have describe in my long post is for real weapon, i just take reference with airsoft replica, some airsoft replica are so close to the real one that some soldier can't see the difference until they shoot/drop the mag or open it, and several airsoft replica/airsoft gear are made by real gun manufacturer, example with the M107 replica, so expensive that you can almost buy the real one or at least a a real gun for sure.
What i have described is the way that REAL weapon work and the way it MUST work for a VIDEO GAME cause don't forget that use your arms/hands and your body is way different than using a mouse and a keyboard.
And anyway in a game like Arma the leak of bipod is really stupid, we have ballistic, wind deflection, recoil (badly implemented) and unlike game like Battlefield (wish have a short engagement range) the engaging range is really huge like real life and mainly with cal 50/.408 sniper riffle where we have weapon sway from an asthmatic guy that can't hold his breath for more than 10 seconds (stupid) it is really stupid and bad to not implement bipod AND resting, and it is not hard to implement, but anyway the incomplete inventory need lower attachment, to be implemented, resting work with a simple collision detection and need the player to use a keyboard command, when a bipod is installed the same command will be use for deploying bipod wish will automatically stabilize the weapon when a collision is detected.
We MUST don't need ACE for this...
Demongornot continue to request airsoft simulator. So sad.
Sure, it's in ACE but what if i don't want those things with ACE and i want only weapon deploying?
This is the single feature that I miss the most in Beta. Please implement it. The way it is now, high cover is practically useless.
You're not contributing to the discussion Anachortes.
I hope this gets added as IMO sniper rifles and LMGs are incomplete until there bipods are used. This would make for an awesome attachment option on other guns too :)
Oh such cool story Demongornot :)
Still not created :( this sad.
If you're going to post an essay, can you do that on the forum.
A bipod only helps to have a steady aim specially while wielding heavy weapons, and it doesn't diminish recoil.
Please, if you implement this, implement it in a realistic way.
So it mean that the ONLY hope to have realistic things will be to wait ACE 3 who will implement weapon resting and bipod.
I hope they will find what i have read and take inspiration from it for weapon/resting system, recoil based on riffle AND ammo, recoil itself fix and maybe other idea i have give here.
Its stupid cause its a really important feature, and that why i don't considerate Arma like a simulator but more like a "half realism game" and more they will delete/limit feature from real life and make limitation useless and unrealistic to the player, more i will considerate Arma like a non realistic game.
I have think about buy the supporter edition but if they don't want us to have less useless limitation and more realistic feature i will not cause i don't want to support this logic.
Seriously, not implementing resting or at least bipod in a game supposed to be a simulation and who have machine gun and sniper its the stupidest idea i have ever hear about, even Battlefield 3 who is not realistic at all have this kind of feature, i'm really disappointed to see an arcade game have more feature than a sim know for have a lot of functions/possibility/features.
Its supposed to be better than BF3 and COD cause "if we can do it in real life, we can probably do it in Arma"
Rather than be able to climb a wall in real life and not able in Arma, i can deploy and use my bipod with my airsoft sniper.
I really hope you are wrong tyl3r99...
Even the developer Neokika what this feature and the first post on the wishlist thread (except the main one who list all wish) say in the first wish :
Gameplay
Weapon resting
Bipods are modelled. They should be usable.
Would be a realistic feature. Would be a cool a feature.
The end.
they have already said they are not planning on implementing this feature...
I think you talk mainly about vertical recoil, but i will explain you that its not true but vertical recoil and talk a little about longitudinal recoil.
Its a long post so i hope it will be use as a reference when we talk about recoil in Arma.
The longitudinal recoil is always absorbed by the body, more powerful the weapon is, and more our body will be pushed back, in crouch position its almost like stand up, you just have a better balance it mean more stability and a little better absorption of the recoil but not much, but prone position our body almost entirely absorb the recoil effect, the longitudinal recoil is almost the same in prone and crouch.
Keep in mind that the vertical effect its not caused by the weapon itself but by the longitudinal recoil.
The vertical recoil is different, in stand up its a little more effective than crouch position, but not a big difference, but in prone position the vertical recoil is different and more absorbed by our body, the weapon vertical movement is way smaller...
But any action to resting or using a bipod change completely the recoil, not only the stability.
When you are on stand up or crouch position and you resting the weapon against a wall or anything else or you use a bipod, its way different cause you can press your weapon down and apply a force in continue, it mean your longitudinal recoil is affected by the fact that you not only absorb and counter the recoil when it come with a little delay, but you always apply a force, first against the surface where the weapon is resting/"bipoded" and when you shoot against the weapon itself, the longitudinal recoil is decreased but not cancelled, and the vertical recoil is really decreased too, your weapon will still "jump" of the wall but its more controllable but still clearly noticeable.
But in prone position its different, your weapon have 3 force against it, your own body who absorb the major part of the longitudinal recoil, the surface where you resting/"bipoding" your weapon, and you who force the weapon to stay down + the gravity/weapon weight.
Keep in mind that a weapon itself DON'T have vertical recoil, the vertical recoil is only created by a physic problem, our body is pushed in a direction and it apply a force in the opposite direction, that cause the weapon to go in another direction, left/right (rare) or up/down, and by the way the body work (feet, the surface that don't move and the up of the body that move cause of the weapon recoil) during the absorption of the longitudinal recoil, but its way more affected by the fact that you handle it under the barrel and it create a rotation, the weapon go up, some weapon with a flash hider compensate it, and you can even find some feedback of some rare weapon that apply a vertical recoil down and not up cause of the flash hider.
I agree in stand up and crouch position the recoil vertical and longitudinal is not canceled but still clearly affected, but in prone position its way different.
Even the "hard to shoot in stand up and stay up" M107 cal50 sniper when you are sit on a chair or prone you have a small longitudinal effect and an almost missing vertical effect, you can only slowly noticed it inside a zoomed scope.
Example here for sit : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0LNwotuEOQ
and here for prone : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vki4MUMBKc
This is cause the force is applied to your body and absorb it on a longitudinal way only, the vertical recoil (who is only a conversion of the longitudinal recoil cause of the body physic and the handle position of the gun) is not present, and you don't have a big longitudinal recoil cause your body have more stability with a weapon resting or with a bipod than stand up without any contact surface, even without weapon or cloths the body is not stable, you always fight for not fall but its unconscious.
Even a big 20mm gun while prone and using a bipod have a big longitudinal recoil and a small (missing?) vertical recoil :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ft2j6J4NcY
In stand up, with a bipod or resting the weapon you have a bigger longitudinal recoil but again cause you have a surface that help you, you have stability + no (almost no) vertical recoil.
See here : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RWf8-rQz3Y
Without bipod/resting you see a really huge difference, example with a guy shooting the M107 (my reference in this explanation who have a big recoil) in stading position, he more suffer about the weapon weight than the recoil effect.
He don't apply any force to the down, he only compensate longitudinal recoil which is converted into a movement of the top of the body and a vertical recoil (without vertical recoil the guy will probably take a ride in the air without an airplane), the vertical recoil when done lets the weapon fall, and when your body back to the original position the weapon will back to horizontal (initial in case of you shoot not in horizontal position) position by gravity and your movement that bring it back to the correct aiming direction exactly like if you aim up before you start to shoot, you lets the weapon come down and shoot, your job while shooting is not to compensate against vertical recoil is to fight against longitudinal recoil and when the vertical recoil movement is finish fight against gravity for avoid the weapon to aim down cause of the gravity.
Exemple here : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gyjo5BObCPE
We can clearly see him fight against gravity, when he shoot the weapon create a longitudinal movement which finish into a vertical movement that he don't try to compensate, the weapon will really fast back to the original position cause of the gravity, we can clearly see him back to fight against the weapon weight when he done each shoot, if you look really carefully you can also see a lateral movement (recoil) that come only after the shoot, its created cause when you shoot a weapon you use a side of your body, the left or (mainly) the right shoulder, and when you shoot the longitudinal movement create a rotation if its hard enough cause your shoulder that absorb the weapon recoil will move more than the other, with small caliber it will make your both shoulder move in the same time, your whole upper body part take the recoil and the difference is really small between both shoulder, it mean almost no lateral movement, but with bigger caliber you are forced to compensate the main recoil by create a vertical movement that fight against gravity and a lateral movement who can create the rotation of the body who don't make you fall on the ground, both lateral and vertical effect is created by your body who find a way to don't fall.
Without bipod/resting in crouch position its a little different, you have more longitudinal recoil and less vertical recoil and almost no lateral recoil, why ?
Cause in crouch position you are more stable, its harder yo make you fall, it mean your body can take bigger longitudinal movement without fall or need to step back for avoid to fall, the rest of the weapon inertia is converted into a vertical recoil but not enough for create a lateral recoil effect, but cause in crouch your have better absorption of the initial recoil, the vertical will be smaller than the one you have in stand up position.
See here : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbdC2sRPJLY
All i have write here is true for semi auto shoot, for full auto its a little different.
The weapon act at the same way, but depending of the firing rate you will need to compensate initial longitudinal recoil and both vertical and lateral, why ?
Simply cause, like i have explain, you initially don't compensate vertical recoil while shooting, you only compensate main (longitudinal) recoil and the weapon who will back at horizontal position cause of the gravity, but in automatic or semi auto with high shooting rate its different cause if the weapon shoot faster enough the next shoot will appear before the gravity finish the job and back the weapon to the original position (which is aimed to the target) it mean each shoot the weapon will slowly go up and you will need to compensate the vertical recoil, the almost insignificant lateral recoil will begin to be noticeable cause of the accumulation of movement of your body don't yet finish to back in original stability position, it will slowly compensate (but its not noticeable) and will be clearly accentuate by the fact that your body cause of a continuous alternative force on a single side of your body will make you deviate left or right depending of the side you handle the weapon.
But with a bipod again its different cause now you can apply a continue force on the weapon, the bipod will prevent it to go under the point you aim and when you use a full auto/high shoot cadence weapon with a bipod you don't only put it on the surface but also apply a part of your own weight on the weapon.
The fact that now you have 3 force against the vertical recoil change totally.
Gravity + you don't lets the weapon go up + your body weight that give you more stability and lets you less affected by initial recoil.
The initial recoil who is way less present don't make your body need to lets the weapon go up for balance it cause now you absorb it at 100% or in fact at 95% maybe and you forcing the weapon to avoid it to go up finish the job.
The vertical recoil is not big like people want to, example here with a M249 in stand up position without any bipod/resting applied on a surface : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hCPMdNCRPU
We can clearly see the longitudinal recoil which make the body of the guy go back and when he finish to shoot we see the weapon weight back to action and he need to compensate it, but this guy is good and correctly anticipate the weapon reaction that why we don't see a big "aim down" effect after each burst.
Another example here : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oiD5NxXtExQ
This guy have less experience with this weapon and we can clearly see him not correctly handle the longitudinal recoil, he create almost more lateral deviation than vertical one and we can see after each burst the weapon movement, go down and go up, cause he don't know the weapon enough and rather than anticipate each burst end which lets back the weapon to full gravity handle, he lets the weapon go down too much and back to control it, its not his fault except really good shooters or people who experiencing a lot of various weapon, we can't do this without learn the weapon.
With a bipod you have no vertical or lateral recoil, only the longitudinal one, look here : with a M249 again with a bipod in stand up :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vx_Kq5eURyw
I hope you have learn about weapon recoil physic ! =)
And in fact in Arma the recoil is false, we are forced to use the mouse down for compensate the vertical recoil and when we have finish to shoot the weapon stay up, wish is totally false and unrealistic and don't help to feel how weapon shoot.
Rather than limit, annoying the player and restrict people who have a small mouse pad like me and who are forced to move the mouse to the original position by raise it (annoying as possible) its natural for the body to compensate a force, we don't have to handle it in the game, it give useless difficulty, mainly for 2 tings :
First : we using realistic characteristic's weapon with realistic bullet trajectory and rather than use the more natural, intuitive and easy to use devise in the world : our hands, the mouse have way more stability than hands okey, but way less precision, for precision we need to take our time to place the cursor where we want.
Seconds : bots, rather than simulate soldier who using hands (not mouse) are also wrong and don't feel any recoil/weapon deviation effect.
How recoil effect must work ?
Simply with the same vertical recoil but with a weapon who don't stay stuck aim up when we done shoot, we are supposed to embody a living organism who can compensate force unconsciously and :
Certainly not a robot who need to do it manually (a robot compute itself the equilibrium of the body for avoid to fall and any recoil effect, human brain do it in unconscious part for most of the work, its stupid to make us do a work that the conscious part are not supposed to do.
And certainly not a robot or a turret who completely stop all movement by literally block it before human do it, human lets weapon back to original position and don't stay like a stupid with the weapon aim up when done shooting.
It mean :
_Less vertical deviation effect, a really small one depending of the weapon (i talk about the deviation of the aiming point, not the recoil who stay the same)
_No more weapon who stay up like if we magically compensate gravity at the nanosecond that we finish to shoot (look at how Battlefield 3 machine gun work, it is better and more realistic, we can clearly see the weight effect when we finish to shoot even if BF3 is supposed to be more arcade than Arma 3.)
_More deviation from the initial aiming point but not created by the vertical or lateral recoil/deviation but created by the fact that we can't lets the weapon back to the exact initial position, we always will have a shift, and its our work to compensate it and not the vertical recoil.
_Possibility to step back or even fall when using weapon with huge recoil like shotgun, with a huge vertical recoil effect wish make the weapon point up almost 25° of the original point if the weapon is a really huge caliber and back itself at the original position but take a delay.
We can clearly see it here : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=srV8stO_YH0
We see the guy having a huge recoil that make the weapon point 25° up (or something like this) and it is a natural movement to lets the weapon back to the original position and not a forced one, the forced one is when the weapon finish to "fall" he handle it back, wish create a down deviation effect but not an up or the guy who stay stuck to aim up.
_Different recoil depending of the weapon AND the ammo, each ammo have different recoil effect on the same weapon, and same ammo have different recoil effect with different weapon.
Good demo here of how the recoil must act : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u98APuxaQjo
Recoil must be present and hard but the weapon must back to the original position with a deviation "like Arma 3 actually do" but with a deviation cause we can't magically back exactly to the original position at the exact same precision on target, we have a big deviation, up, down, left, right and aleatory, but we DON'T (in real life) stay stuck like a turret in the last position of the riffle, the gravity must do its job just after that we have the recoil effect and only after we begin to compensate it but not instantaneously.
I admit in Arma 2 we have really ridiculous heavy movement exactly like if we control a turret with way too much inertia so back to the original position its not that's bad, but in Arma 3 its not cause we have more fluid movement that we must compensate thing that we don't in real life.
This other video shot better how it work (well) in Arma 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TILnkKbW2ro except that it come back with too much precision on the original point.
Anyways i will stop before i write a book.
But i hope people will begin to understand that a weapon don't have a vertical recoil that make the weapon reach orbital altitude at each shoot and that their is a difference between what our brain do for us (subconscious) and what we doing ourselves (conscious).
A realist game must do everything the subconscious do or at least don't lets us do it but don't do what conscious must do.
Anyways you now know that a weapon recoil is affected by a bipod and you know why.
Congratulation to those who have read the whole thing, i wish you can find a good cookie !
Sorry for my English.
It is an obvious need.
A good machingunner should fire 99% of the time (just a number) while resting on bipod.
Also when deffending fortified positions everybody rests their weapons while firing most of the time.
I guess they are trying to make it perfect (static point of rest, animations, AI implementation and so on) and because of that they hadn't released it yet. What I spect is that if they don't have the time to do it the realistic way they will release it as just a button that reduces your recoil while static over a point of support.
VTS is just reduce the recoil but not stop a weapon swaying which is more importantly.
Everyones not keen on downloading a mod to play a game which should be polished/ready to go upon it's release without needing mods to fix broken things.
Button that reduces recoil is ok only if you are a modmaker that doesn't have access to the engine. In spite of this fact I think that waiting for what BIS want to do is better (A3 is still pre-release so they have much time to polish the system).
And if you want the "button that reduces recoil" right now instead of waiting some more complex bipod/resting system than download a "VTS Simple weapon resting" and enjoy it.
And almost everyone prefer a button that reduces recoil than wait until Arma 4 to see it...
Anyway i hope Devs won't do a unrealistic resting system.
But maybe a system with a button that can resting weapon when a collision under the riffle is detected with a difference of stability and recoil damper between stand up, kneeling or prone.
AND another totally different system for weapon with bipod, the resting button must deploy and retract the bipod REGARDLESS of collision, it must lets us able to deploy it everytime we want and always stabilize the riffle when a collision is detected without need to press any button.
Simply cause its the way that bipod work, i have several airsoft replica, 3 of them are sniper and have a bipod, when i remove or don't deploy the bipod i need to stabilize the riffle in a clear spot to avoid it to rip off the surface every time i move for aiming but when the bipod is deployed i simply placed it on the surface and its done.
I really hope BIS Devs wont make a stupid and unrealistic restriction like Battlefield 3 and other arcade game where when we are next to a surface where we can resting the weapon we always need to deploy bipod and it will stupidly need to be retracted every time we move and act like a turret who attach us and the weapon on the ground, i really hope Devs will read this and approve that this restriction is completely inappropriate and stupid for a simulation.
I'm really afraid that it will happen and if it will be the case, no one will take a bipod in attachment and sniper and machingunner will be borring about it...
Also hope under attachment with handgrip, grenade launcher, shotgun, bipod and combo handgrip/bipod will be implemented
Combo Handgrip/bipod who provide stability like handgrip and possibility to deploy the bipod when we want, maybe with less recoil and aiming sway damper than recular bipod cause its cheaper depending on the model :
http://762precision.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/t-pod-g2-pr-swivel-bipod-on-m4.jpg
http://www.defensereview.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/grip_pod_system_chen_lee_4.jpg
Why i talk about lower rail attachment ?
Cause what is in this rail MUST affect the resting of the weapon.
A weapon with a bipod or combo handgrip/bipod must always act in at the same way even if the combo or even the bipod itself depending on the model must affect with different value the weapon and it feet perfectly with my ticket here that can permit to have better and more realistic choice of attachment including bipod :
http://feedback.arma3.com/view.php?id=9177
But depending on other kind of attachment like :
Simple handgrip who must give better stability when resting than a regular weapon without attachment on lower rail and have better tolerance to distance between the collision surface and the riffle but a disadvantage that make it losing the resting spot more easily, even while shooting, and for try it myself with the handgrip on my SR25 it is realistic cause it propose stable, fast and easy resting spot opportunity but it also subject to make the weapon rip off the spot.
Things like grenade launcher must make harder to find a resting spot cause its lower and its a round lower surface so it must give less stability than handgrip but must keep the resting spot with more tolerance cause its a huge contact surface.
Things like nude rail or rail with cover http://www.rvops.co.uk/imagecache/61229dd1-5deb-4f18-9f7b-a0e400c54a01_603x510.jpg (cover who must give better stability for resting and simply aiming, not much but still affect it cause its way more better to handle a weapon with rail cover) must be the default resting parameters of the weapon.
Things like angled fore grip http://gearsofguns.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/magpul-073-de_3_mark.jpg or shotgun like the famous M26 http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/98/PEO_M26_MASS_on_M4_Carbine.jpg must be horrible for resting, hard to find a resting spot, small amount of recoil and aiming sway and easy to loose the resting spot, cause the lower surface is really bad for resting a weapon.
But lower shotgun like the MAUL http://marinesmagazine.dodlive.mil/files/2010/04/mariens_maul.jpg must have a way better tolerance, close to grenade launcher.
It is just some code line to put for each lower attachment, not hard to do for modders.
And if we want a realistic resting system and if 4 rail like we have in real life, we must have this kind of value depending on the lower attachment.
Then it's better to wait until BIS will finish their perfect variant and enjoy it than to make them "release it as just a button that reduces recoil" and suffer until the release of Arma 4.
Sorry their is too much to read, i apologize if anyone already say the same than me.
First of all like i have already say in my wishlist and some ticket say about attachment, we must have a lower attachment with hand grip, bipod, grenade launcher and other, the bipod is the key.
Dev please look at this mods : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COLOCtiZYmo
Weapon resting provide the possibility to resting a bipodless weapon on any surface (i think its when a collision under the weapon is detected) we must have a vanilla possibility to do so with a keyboard key, probably the same that we must use for deploy bipod cause its useless to resting weapon with bipod and it will save keyboard key.
Don't forget to put inside Arma 3 or at least give possibility to modders to use the combined hand grip/bipod : http://www.xdtalk.com/gallery/data/500/medium/gps01.jpg
http://762precision.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/t-pod-g2-pr-swivel-bipod-on-m4.jpg
Something like weapon resting with a key and when we have a bipod deploy it automatically resting when a collision is detected.
upvote +1 finally there is topic about bipods and reducing recoil in any weapon especially on sniper rifles, besides on our new sniper rifles that was added not long a go there are already bipods but ... you cant use them thats... stupid
I think SHIFT + RMB (similar to BF3) could be better.
That videos not a bad implementation, it looks pretty clean.
Most of your points after the video though have been discussed.
Lets rest those weapons..