Loot spawning/central economy seems to spawn a handful of items everywhere
Assigned, WishlistPublic

Description

There appears to be a strange pattern with the new loot system, this results in the same item being spawned in the same buildings type across the map repeatedly which leads to stale loot economy on servers which didn't luck out and spawn ammo/guns where other servers spawn endless guns and ammo.

An easy example of this would be deerstands or airfield tents. Typically if you go to tents you will find the same items in each tent just in slightly different numbers. An immediate responce might be 'well its a fixed loot table so you will see the same items sometimes' but this doesnt seem to account for it.

--for example.

On one server -every- tent at the airfield will have at least one SKS, sometimes 3-4 per tent. Every-single-tent. If you join another server, every tent will have ak74 and AKS, but no sks at all. Some servers -every-tent- will have 7.62x39, multiple boxes in every single tent, the next server might have -NO- 7.62x39 in any of the tents, but each tnet has 1-3 AKM magazines or 1-3 VSS ammo, never a healthy mix of items.

The method of loot calls/central loot server isn't very clear, but here is my rough hypothesis.

When a tent asks for a new peice of loot to spawn and a request is sent to the central loot server (or whatever happens) then one item randomly rolled and selected, but every tent with a missing item receives that item. This happens over and over each time one of the tents (or any building) needs an item, this results in servers having a massive amount of one item and very little item variety.

eg, Tent 1 needs an item, it is told to spawn an SKS, all tents from 1-20 spawn an SKS each, sometimes more than 1 if they have multiple missing items. Later tent 15 needs an item, it is told to spawn AKM mag, tents 1-20 all spawn AKM mags, after a few repeats of this, all 20 tents have the same loot, just in slightly different quantities due to some tents having more missing items than others when a loot call is made.

For example, some servers have rice in every house, every car, every barn. almost no beans, almost no bacon, almost on powdered milk etc. It's like a residential spawn asked for an item, rice was selected and every house with a missing item receives the rice. The same goes for guns, I will find magnum after magnum after magnum on one server, then Mosin after mosin after mosin on the next, sometimes 2-3 of the same rifle in the same town, then 2-3 more of the rifle in the next town. The same goes for camo, facemasks, It is very common to find them same 15 items every server, and very very very rarely find any alternative items.

This might be a biproduct of an attempt to keep server/loot server messaging down, if 10,000 items are needed it would probably take a lot of resources to do 10,000 individual random item rolls, I can see how efficient it would be to call for 1 residential/military/industrial loot roll - then dish that same item out to several places that need it, but maybe the number of places taking the item is too high or bugging out.

  • This should be easy enough to confirm by debugging a servers loot tables for specific buildings (tents, deerstands, barracks) what you might see is

server 1 - all tent loot:

100 ASK-74
120 SKS
100 TTSKO jackets
95 buttstocks
7 AK74
5 AKM
11 hats
6 boots
5 gorka jackets
10 VSS ammo boxes
7 VSS magazines

server 2 - all tent loot:

100 vss ammo boxes
90 VSS magazines
85 AKM
75 AKM Magazines
9 hats
6 boots
5 helmets
4 buttstocks
5 AK74 mags

there seems to be a massive stack of 2-3 items, then a tiny sprinkling of random items. This cant be accounted for by 'players just leaving the other items behind' because typically tents will be STACKED with one weapon, sure players might not want it, but its on the floor in the first place, players arent carrying SKS up to the tents and leaving them in piles.

  • This can be also observed by watching streams, I will routinely say 'this is a rice server guys' and go on to find 20-30 bags of rice while looting towards the airfield. if i server swap, i wont find ANY rice, only bacon. Same with deerstands, if the first deerstand I loot has 2 axes and 2 winter hunter pants and a range finder, the rest of the deerstands will have the same items - sometimes there are variations here and there, but generally the items are very limited.
  • Examples I can think of off the top of my head

Barracks - either spawn LOTS of medical clothes OR lots of gorka OR plate carriers OR high cap vests every rarely a mixed combination

Hangars - either spawn 3-4 per Plate carriers OR 3-4 green sweaters per hangar, never a healthy mix of gorka/sweaters/plate carriers/high capacity vets/boots etc

Sheds - sometimes I will loot from cherno to the airfield and end up with 10 burlap, 0 wire. next server will be constant wire, no burlap, next server will be batteries in every shed but no burlap or wire, it's never a healthy mix.

The problem this causes for the game is that people that are on a 'lucky server' eg. SKS/SKS AMMO spawning everywhere have an interesting time, while others loot for hours and find no ammo because the server simply didnt roll that class of item and therefor only a handful of buildings on the map have ammo, or the clothing they wanted etc. Instead of seeing a wide variety of items and hoping you find what you want, it seems more viable to server swap until you find your item, then loot the server and find TONNES of it.

Details

Legacy ID
3555659636
Severity
None
Resolution
Open
Reproducibility
N/A
Category
Server
Steps To Reproduce

previous post includes suggested methods of identifying issue, players dont control the loot table so its not possible to recommend steps to reproduce this issue. It should simply be apparent from the server data.

Sacriel edited Steps To Reproduce. (Show Details)Jan 8 2016, 2:16 AM
Sacriel set Category to Server.
Sacriel set Reproducibility to N/A.
Sacriel set Severity to None.
Sacriel set Resolution to Open.
Sacriel set Legacy ID to 3555659636.May 9 2016, 12:22 AM
Sacriel edited a custom field.

I have witnessed this strange loot behaviour in every of sacriels streams.

I have also encountered this when gearing up. Same loot over and over in similar loot locations such as tents, deer stands or residential buildings.
This is forcing players to server hop to get a chance to gather the gear they are looking for.

Hicks added a comment.Jan 8 2016, 5:48 PM

Under investigation

Here is a video example of the same loot spawning in a building

http://www.twitch.tv/sacriel/v/34576625

This happens at tents too, every single tent will have 75% buttstocks, and the occasional random item, or 75% akm mags, or 75% VSS box ammo

https://feedback.dayz.com/view.php?id=29207
Please close this as duplicate. This report is more accurate than mine.

Hicks added a comment.Jan 12 2016, 1:32 PM

We're currently tracking several issues with loot tag and category that may affect this. Investigation and testing is ongoing, and then we'll need to regression test to see if this was the cause.

Hicks added a comment.Jan 12 2016, 5:57 PM

An audit on loot categories, and loot tags has been undergoing the last few days. The audit is complete, and some changes in the operation of nominal, min, and max values was committed by the programming team.

We'll need to go through the entire economy and recalculate operating values as they are now on an absolute number value.

Thanks for the update

This issue continues to plague the game, it is especially bad in Balota where you can find literally 5-10 rifles in almost every vehicle or building in Balota

I routinely find 4-5 pistols per car and 5-10 rifles per building in balota on every server

Loot in deerstands continues to be the same few items, 1-3 pairs of binocs in every deerstand - but on another server there are 0 binocs and 90% rangefinders or shotgun snaploaders

is this issue still being worked on?

Re introducing items back into the new rendering engine? or is it really messed up with half the items not showing up.

I want to believe it is the reintroduction of items.

Hicks added a comment.Jan 18 2017, 7:06 PM

This issue continues to plague the game, it is especially bad in Balota where you can find literally 5-10 rifles in almost every vehicle or building in Balota

I routinely find 4-5 pistols per car and 5-10 rifles per building in balota on every server

Loot in deerstands continues to be the same few items, 1-3 pairs of binocs in every deerstand - but on another server there are 0 binocs and 90% rangefinders or shotgun snaploaders

is this issue still being worked on?

The Central Economy (CE) will continue to be worked on and improved throughout development. The issue you mention is something the design and programming teams are very aware of - and steps are being taken to allow us to restrict the amount of certain types of items appearing in a structure - however we will need to carefully test this and see what the limitations are. As DayZ's map, spawn points, regions, and amount of items spawning (cleaning up, respawning, and restocking) is very complex, and system intensive.

Future builds will see continued iteration on this - as the behavior you have mentioned is not the intended behavior the developers want.

I concur, no evidence to put up. But the issue is still ongoing, after a break from the game, I have not seen any loot bombs yet. But we still have objects spawning that are the same in clusters or in close range to each other, so it is still ongoing.

Devs, I know you are aware, just adding my voice to the issue/ bug.

Erik aka hugin.q3

Hatzee added a subscriber: Hatzee.Wed, Jan 25, 9:22 PM

Was on server and police station in Novi Sobar had 6 MP-5s with some mags and silencers, the next day, same building had 5 helmet visors.

dim added a subscriber: dim.EditedMon, Jan 30, 2:47 AM

so you can stop items from spawning in the military jails and add dresses but can fix other items that don't spawn right humm?

take cars out if they don't work take zombies out if they don't work yet you can put those back in and they work but loot isn't? it must be item specific and codes are there just not being used? we have no vehicles in game now so why are there auto parts spawning instead of ammo weapons or food? makes no sense to me at all...

lipek added a subscriber: lipek.Thu, Feb 2, 12:06 AM

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