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The muffler prevents to shoot from the gun. The design of mufflers should be corrected.
Acknowledged, WishlistPublic


Mufflers to of all models guns, complicate an aiming. The alignment level of a sight of the gun looks in the muffler. At firing distance to twenty meters, the problem is less. The aiming on a long distance becomes complicated. The muffler blocks big area, the aiming becomes not exact. The area of a target is hidden behind the muffler. Muffler design not true. The axis of the muffler has to be displaced from the center. It will release the review and an aim level.
Or correction of the line of a sight when the muffler is connected.


Legacy ID
Steps To Reproduce

To come into the Arsenal
To choose "Rook-40" (ACP-C2.45 or P07 9mm), to connect the muffler.
To include test, try to aim on a target, at different distances.

Additional Information

Event Timeline

Lex edited Steps To Reproduce. (Show Details)Jun 12 2015, 12:32 PM
Lex edited Additional Information. (Show Details)
Lex set Category to Visual-Weapons.
Lex set Reproducibility to Always.
Lex set Severity to None.
Lex set Resolution to Open.
Lex set Legacy ID to 4264697942.May 8 2016, 12:13 PM

Most suppressors are NOT designed to be eccentric.
To get around this issue people often use raised iron sights. Just like the 4-five .45 has.
Handguns are used for close distances anyway so having a perfect sight picture isn't essential.
I don't think this is worth redesigning all the suppressors.. Downvote from me.
But that's just my opinion.

Lex added a subscriber: Lex.May 8 2016, 12:13 PM
Lex added a comment.Jun 16 2015, 12:51 AM

The sight on 20 meters in the head is not possible. The head is hidden by the muffler. The breast and feet behind the gun and hands are not visible. A look from the third party and a cross hairs in mission are switched off. The sight optics does not become on all types of guns. The shot has chance of a miss more than hit.
There are many missions where use of riflescopes is switched off. I ask to understand me truly. In such look as it is the muffler not possibly. to use

I don't understand half of what you're saying but accurate shooting is only slightly more difficult with the suppressor blocking the point of impact for your iron sights. You don't need a crosshair or a clear view of your point of impact when you have perception. Here is a good example from my own video.

Lex added a comment.Jun 17 2015, 1:06 AM

Targets fall from one shot. I know it. Try firing in game "arsenal". To dress a bullet-proof vest, to take the gun with the muffler. Strike the first six of a row from one shot. On the third among will start having a problem.

Shields, can you imagine a gun designer IRL saying something like "Nah, shooting is only slightly more difficult with the suppressor..."? Nobody would use this gun. Ever. And this is what you suggest, to not use these gun+silencer combinations in game.
Sorry, I can't assume your video as a valid argument. Real game is much more random than shooting targets in predefined locations. Pre-aiming will almost never work (as at 0:26). And btw your aiming slowed down significantly on moderate distance (0:53). Not saying targets were static and very contrasty to background.
As Lex stated, player might be forced to use some strict combinations by mission. Can you kindly ask all mission authors to fix their missions and prohibit those combinations?
EDIT. Ticket author's problem is those gun+silencer combinations are obviously not usable or of limited use.

I'm just saying they are not a problem. I work as a machinist in a company that makes suppressors and other weapon parts
parts. None of our suppressors are essentric. Take a look at some popular manifacturers and you can see there is not a lot of them. I just think it would be unnessacary work for developers to modify the current suppressors in the game. If you cant continiously hit your target then you need more practice.

Lex added a comment.Jun 19 2015, 10:05 AM

If the design does not matter, it does not matter what it looks like in reality. You can add the possibility of mounting optics to any gun.
What kind of training it. Turn off the crosshair to set up the game. Hit the target at a distance beyond 30 meters. Muffler completely covers the target from the point of sight.
No eccentric suppressors. Must be a gun sight which can not be closed suppressors.

Pistols are not really even effective beyond 30 meters. You can always bring in your sight from below the target which will give you a basic knowledge of its position.

Lex added a comment.Aug 18 2015, 1:07 PM

As far as the gun is effective and is used to decide the player. As such, like a gun with a silencer now, he is not exactly efficient. Review any modifications pistol with a silencer, you will not find this, where the muffler is a barrier between the target and sighting device.
I must always see the target, silencer should not be a hindrance.

Upvoted, as i dont use pistols, i see only one fix good for developers and for players. Its optic for pistols. Anybody see diferent way?

More - there is supressors for gun which with you can aim easly so @Shields - i doubt you are working where you says.

And dont forget THIS IS 2035 IN GAME! More technique, better supressors!

I never said there aren't essentric suppressors. I said they are not common, which is infact true. I work for Oulun työstökeskus Oy and none of our suppressors are essentric, nothing gives you the right to question my integrity. You can look at our stock for yourself.
Sure there are few essentric suppressors but the most common solution is simply raised ironsights or a collimator sight as i said above. The only essentric suppressor in your examples is the silencerco osprey which might still require raised ironsights.

Lex this is getting ridicoulus with you my russian friend but thats something else.
What might be a problem is you can add a special iron sight on the silencer BUT you need to change the aiming view. And really im hitting running people on 20m with a P07 with silencer 2-3 times with 10 shots. Whe i need to fire further i dont use a pistol thats nonsense to use them and a rifle is better in such distance especially at armored targets.
Just BTW Lex in your video i see that you have no idea how to aim with a pistol what makes me asking how you can judge about a functionality of a weapon without knowing how to use it?
And another thing to mention is that the effectiveness of a weapon is not given by the user its given by the manufactorer by his design. The user than can decide if he wants to use the weapon with its designed pros and cons or if he will use another weapon thats maybe better for the purpose?

Lex added a comment.Sep 2 2015, 12:12 PM

I agree with that that it is possible to use optics a sight on the gun. What to do with models of guns on which there is no optics, there is no installation of an additional sight. You show mufflers for where installation of optics is provided. In my ticket a gun picture without optics, and the muffler on it is executed with shift of the center.
On any gun in Arma3 can put optics?
Tell about purpose of a sight which is closed by the muffler.
In my video it is shown how many time I spend on firing on the purposes. With the muffler - 24 seconds on four purposes. Without muffler - 15 seconds on four purposes. It not the best result. It shows a constructive mistake which influences quality of use in such execution.
Show me video where you have an identical result.

Im talking about silencers with ironsight on them for example the M9 beretta has such. What im telling you about your pistol use is you dont know the distance on that the iron sight is zeroed by default thats why you dont see your target in close range. You are aiming WAY to high and after 20 to 30 m, what the maximum of a pistol in combat is you use MP or rifles, the silencer would give you a bad view on your target.
And its not a constructive mistake when you use the weapon wrong the other way americas weapon producers wouldnt have enought money after everyone would be complaining that they shot themselves when cleaning because of a constructive mistake.

Additional: the makarov you give as an example has a special silencer not a standard one.

Everything is fine, but remember, its 2035 in game - ironsight on supressors, or essentric suppressors would be normal these days. Noone getting ridiculus here, we just want to polished (finished), enjoyable game, thats all

The reason they are not popular is because they are unnecessary for handguns, as the range is so limited anyway. Just because its 2035 that doesn't make them necessary.

Lex added a comment.Sep 2 2015, 4:39 PM

Guns have advantages where the muffler doesn't prevent to aim?
There is a lot of examples, the armorer understands advantages, the aim alignment is open.
There are examples and such design, an alignment on the muffler.
I assume, at a gun choice, any chose for himself the gun with an open alignment of a sight. It induced me to do this ticket. Guns in such look as now in Armagh 3, don't want to choose for use.
Tell this guy about firing from the gun on 20-30 meters - 1.12 minute on video

You're just showing examples of raised ironsights and toy guns. Instead of messing with the suppressor models they could perhaps add raised ironsights as an option or add more red dot sights like the trijicon RMR.

I know this funny guy hes good but he is a trickshooter not a soldier. He is firing a revolver on 50m on a standing target. I did the same with a P8! And never again in stressfull situations. You wont hit a shit. He has time to aim he has no one shooting at him. The aiming is not difficult because his weapon is zeroed on 50m. Now imagine there are bullets flying around enemies right in front of you about 15m you have a M4 or any other assault rifle or bigger MP and you have a 9mm pistol. What you gonna use a 12 shots for a lucky hit or 30 shots for a kill?

A solution for everyone i think : Add a couple if sights for silencers. I mean sights that you put on the weapon. The problem occurs when im right only on the pistols so just add a sight for them like the yorris but without batteries. No change on the silencer models just new sights. Everyone agreeing?

@TheMasterofBlubb Sometimes magazine of 30 rounds is empty and you need another one - ops, empty pockets! So this is the situation where you use pistol in the most cases. Also officers of some factions dont use SMG's or assault riffles, they use pistols. My advice as same as yours - add iron sights for supressors (easiest way) or another additional optics, this time only for pistols.

1.when you have no mags left you are doing something terribly wrong in your job.

  1. When you only have your pistol left you better hide in the deepest hole you find and hope that the enemy is out ammo just like you.
  2. When using your pistol for defending try to use it on less then 10m to save ammo and not waste it like the other 300 rifle shots you are normally carrying.

4.If you cannot use 2. Then you must learn in a short time how to sprint in your full gear as far away as you can.

  1. Call for help!!!!

Thats what i learned in the army.
Officers use only pistols humm yeah sometimes but they have like 10 or more people with rifles for defense.

Just for info there is no case but one where a shortbarrelled MP or SMG cannot outstand any pistol.this one case is the worst case you can ever have: firing on an enemy from 2m to 5m.

As an ex soldier i can tell you that pistol is best for close range like search buildings, and close quarters contact. We was never using Rifle in this case.
"1.when you have no mags left you are doing something terribly wrong in your job."
That the proof you havent been in the army, or on real battlefield - i lost all ammo being surrounded by 2 "squads" of talibans for almost one day! We havent any possibility to call reinforcments, we just had to wait. When the "cavalary" came for us we had almost empty even pistol magazines. I served there almost 4 years and you tell me what to do when my ammo is empty.....
Close range is third case for pistols, and in most cases they are supressed in this missions.

Making things wrong is human but somethings like for example carrying a communication device for calling help are essential for some for some not. There comes the question why you couldnt call help ? How you got surrounded? Why you lost your ammo? Why you fire your pistols? Because the enemy was near or because you wanted to fire back? This are questions where the mistake is to find. Its not that you in person have to make a mistake but you are in a situation that not should happen and i really mean that not should happen. Close range i still prefer a shortbarreled MP or SMG because of the fire rate and magsize. And what problems do you have when going into a building when the max distance is 10m when you have silencer without raised ironsights or other extra sights on the silencer?
Then i think you agree that you mostly fire at non armoured targets when fighting in buildings. So 1 shot is mostly enough atleast 2 are deadly when placed in the chest. Thats not what the ticketwriter wants when he says he wants a method to fire 30m against a armoured target to kill it with several shots.

Lex added a comment.Sep 3 2015, 5:14 PM

The option - the Muffler doesn't prevent to aim
Option - the Muffler a bullet opening not in the center.
And even such options)))

In the second movie look at 2:47. Your gun sight is still obscured. So it helps, but not much.

I don't understand your demo in the arsenal, trying to shoot people in the head from a large distance. This is totally unrealistic for actual combat.

It's fine if you want to shoot like that, but that's target-shooting, like a sport. For sport-shooting you don't need a suppressor.

Lex added a comment.Sep 4 2015, 2:03 AM

If to look as it is correct to aim

at 2:47 the hindrance won't be such as now in Arma3 on all guns
Come into a game arsenal, try all guns. It is sure, from any gun, without muffler, you easily will be able to hit the target further than 30 meters.
The gun has no corrections of a sight in Arma3 with the muffler. If to shoot at the purpose reference on a point 1 (red point in the third drawing) you will get much below.
For example.
At "4-five 45 ACP" the sight is perfectly visible when the muffler is dressed. And on it it is possible to put optics)).
At "P07 9mm" with the muffler the aiming becomes complicated. Opportunities to establish optics aren't present.

@TheMasterofBlubb You really dont undertsand how things are complicating on battlefield. There is no game showing this. We was using ammo only for "sure shot", so we were saving ammo, but please, against 20 talibans every hour it was very hard. They were NOT saving ammo on us. Comunication device - all of them stopped working for unknown reason (it was looking as for some emp or something that talibans doesnt have!) It wasnt fault of any of us we got surrounded. We was on patrol, and talibans show up all around us. This situations you can call "dynamic situation" where everything fine turns into dust and you are up on your own and few buddies with pistols. Mortar destroyed our truck, and one of us lost his hand with rifle, he got only pistol you hate so much....

Lex added a comment.Sep 4 2015, 1:46 PM

@TheMasterofBlubb. I didn't bring up this question, that I consider the gun the best weapon from all.))) There are situations when its application is necessary, tactical advantage in any situation, or a situation - there are no cartridges in the machine gun or a rifle.
If there is a weapon, it has to work and not create additional problems on its use. There is no sense to lose advantage of the muffler, it is simple to remove it, what to have an opportunity to shoot on distance more than 10-20 meters.
I hope in further development of the scenario in Armagh 3. Emergence of system of wounds when wound of the right or left hand forces you to look for a way out. You will have a favourite gun, in such situation.)))
I understand. Who loves planes, tanks aren't interesting.)))