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Revert "3D" optics to old "2D" variant
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In scope of #2510, a "compromise" 3d optics variation was implemented. Personally, I strongly dislike it - because of the following reasons:

1.It creates a TrackIR cheat opportunity - if a player uses TrackIR, he can look to side, gaining "free" full-screen zoom
2.A reverse side of p.1. - such sights are hard to use with TrackIR
3.It looks unrealistic - the outside of the scope is also zoomed in
4.It creates bugs - like the bug with the DoF causing the reticle to blur or the sights misalignment
5.The weapon sway is much harder to compensate when weapon is swaying independently of screen.

To fix these issues, there exist a modset (TMR). However, many servers do not allow mods at all, or, sometimes, TMR just can't be used for other reasons. This creates inconsistent gameplay experience in different circumstances.

In my opinion, current "3D" scopes are misimplemented. I'd like to request revert of the "3D" scopes (RCO,ARCO,MRCO) to old "2D" type.


Legacy ID
Feature Request
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Event Timeline

DarkWanderer edited Additional Information. (Show Details)
DarkWanderer set Category to Feature Request.
DarkWanderer set Reproducibility to N/A.
DarkWanderer set Severity to None.
DarkWanderer set Resolution to Open.
DarkWanderer set Legacy ID to 581298667.May 7 2016, 5:55 PM

Doesn't seem BI is interested in it anymore :(
PiP scopes are certainly better. I'm all in for proper implementation. But given the choice between current terrible scopes and "old" 2D ones, I choose 2D.

They could at least lock the view as a short term fix like sniper scopes so you can't look away.

Being able to look away from magnified scopes with TrackIR is more annoying than an advantage in my opinion because the movement is amplified and over sensitive due to the zoom.
But it's brilliant with iron sights & the ACOG scopes, I can't play ARMA or any other simulation without TrackIR :-)

AD2001 added a subscriber: AD2001.May 7 2016, 5:55 PM

I disagree. I think the current implementation is better (not a lot, but still better) than the old 2D scopes. Besides, you can still mod 2D scopes, can't you?

FrankHH added a subscriber: FrankHH.May 7 2016, 5:55 PM

They could at least fix the bugs instead of reverting to the old 2D scopes. Upvoted anyway.

Bohemia added a subscriber: Bohemia.May 7 2016, 5:55 PM

Wow those PIP video tests look terrific! It's just a shame that PIP itself is limited in some ways with draw distance and not drawing any shadows...still I'd love to see that example demonstrated in a firefight to see what effect it can have on gameplay.

Not to mention that the 3D scopes drift spasmodically around the screen. I would like to think that 20 years into the future that we have the good sense not to uninvent cheekweld.

@machineabuse yeah it's like your cheek moves away from your eyes. F*cking stupid.

pops added a subscriber: pops.May 7 2016, 5:55 PM
pops added a comment.Feb 12 2014, 1:54 AM

I like the 3D scopes, I wish the DMS, LRPS and SOS would also be like that.

5.The weapon sway is much harder to compensate

when weapon is swaying independently of screen.

I agree. At times, the weapon sway is extremely frustrating.

Oooh, I like that PiP! Only problem is that shadows aren't rendered in PiP at the moment, so the graphics look like rubbish when viewed through PiP. It seems that BIS is just spending their time fixing minute bugs, that the big game-breaking things are left behind.

Besides, you can still mod 2D scopes, can't you?

The whole point is to avoid mods while having consistent experience. Right now, half of the scopes in vanilla are 2D, half are "3D". And it's not even tied to magnification really - NVS scope has mid-range zoom, yet is 2D.

Besides, you can still mod "3D" scopes, can't you?

Fair enough.

Also, if you're wondering about the NVS scope (and the other one which have NV/TI), it's most likely 2D because the whole screen would be in nightvision if it was 3D.

It is worth pointing out that magnified optics should not be useable with NVGs.

  1. NVGs alter the eye relief necessary to get a correct sight picture through an NVG.
  2. The scope reticule will not be in focus through NVGs.
  3. If the sight is tritium illuminated it will become a bloomed dot in the center of the NVG picture.
  4. It would be really difficult to get the NV tube lined up correctly with the optic.

All of the above is the reason that MAGNIFIED combat optics are designed exclusively to pair with NV tubes mounted IN FRONT of the scope.

With unmagnified optics (Aimpoint/Eotech) all you need to do is switch the illumination to an NV setting that doesn't turn the reticule into an incoherent washed out mess. That's what it means when those companies make models that are listed as NV compatible.

Now that we have a dedicated NV optic in the game; there isn't adequate reason the player should be allowed such a gross empowerment.

As for the scopes being 3D? Fine. I don't care for them myself but the least this feature needs is the polish so that their functionality is at least on par with the 2d optics in ArmA 2. The very least not being horribly broken for TrackIR users.

I believe there's already a ticket for the bug which makes NVGs usable with magnified optics.

X39 added a subscriber: X39.May 7 2016, 5:55 PM
X39 added a comment.Feb 13 2014, 10:02 PM

its true that the new scopes are not optimal implemented but they are in most cases A WAY better then the old 2d system
as this handles ALL scopes and not specific ones (not only the high zoomed) this ticket is a way over the required
reverting the optics is not the way
improoving the current implementation is MUCH better!
using PiP for example (and yes ... i know about #2510)
at the end
you need to hope that people wont abuse in pvp currently and wait till BI decides (or the community does with a mod for that)

X39: Functionally everything about 3D optics is inferior. The SINGLE improvement that 3D optics brings is that the presentation of the 3d model interacts correctly with the game world i.e. model gets lit correctly by the environment.

If you want to downvote, fine but know at least you are downvoting for a purely cosmetic reason.

Downvoted too. Current implementation is visually much better than the old one.

They should make an option so players can choose their own preference for either 2D or 3D scopes. Personally I really like the way TMR improved the scopes by combining 2D with 3D scopes, it looks way more authentic.

For reference:

The awesome TMR mod is exactly the reason why I created this ticket. TMR scopes behave just like 2D ones - and it feels just so much more comfortable - just like old 2D scopes over current 3D. Unfortunately, TMR brings some non-client-side changes too, so it can't be recommended to be used always - because if some players don't have it, it becomes a mess.

I intend to make a fork of TMR to have a clientside-only addon, but the problem remains valid for core game.