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KA-60 health/strength potentially too high
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When testing the amount of damage different vehicles can take from the same armaments, it was noticed that the KA-60 health/strength is substantially higher than any other vehicle before catching fire/being destroyed.

For example, the same weapon was used on multiple vehicles to note its strength. In this case, the Hunter HMG's RCWS HMG 12.7 mm machine gun was used. The amount of rounds fired into the fuselage/main structure of the different vehicles is noted below: (approximate)

AH-9: 104 rnds
Irfrit: 79 rnds
Speedboat: 30 rnds
KA-60: 696 rnds (and two grenades to finish it off)

Granted the KA-60 is a larger utility helicopter than the AH-6 or MH-6, and as expected the speedboat cannot take many rounds; however, it is hard not to consider the difference in damage it can sustain before being completed crippled when compared to an armored car or light helicopter.


Legacy ID
Steps To Reproduce

1 - Load a game with a few Hunter HMG's (so there is sufficient ammo to destroy a target with and not require re-arming).
2 - Also load in the KA-60.
3 - Fire the Hunter HMG's machine gun into the main fuselage of the KA-60 with as many rounds as possible from each vehicle until it is destroyed and note the number of rounds taken.
4 - Keep all rounds in the same spot so as to ensure that the damage dealt is always the same and not hitting the other vehicle components. (engine, wheels, etc...)
5 - Repeat steps 1,2 and 3 but this time with the AH-9 taking the place of the KA-60.
6 - Repeat steps 1,2 and 3 but this time with the Irfrit taking the place of the KA-60.
7 - Repeat steps 1,2 and 3 but this time with the Speedboat taking the place of the KA-60.

Additional Information

The test was also performed using the AH-9's 2x M134 Minigus against the KA-60 and AH-9. Here were the results: (again, approximate)

AH-9: 475 rnds
KA-60: 1250 rnds

Event Timeline

Bohemia edited Steps To Reproduce. (Show Details)Mar 7 2013, 5:35 AM
Bohemia edited Additional Information. (Show Details)
Bohemia set Category to Balancing.
Bohemia set Reproducibility to Always.
Bohemia set Severity to Minor.
Bohemia set Resolution to Open.
Bohemia set Legacy ID to 463315762.May 7 2016, 11:19 AM

What bothers me most is the fact that the KA-60 cockpit windows are bullet-proof.

Having a parked KA-60 and letting a squad with just machine-guns attack it, the pilots are pretty much safe from any harm. You can shoot all your bullets into the window without even a scratch... I get that they are designed to be bullet-proof, but bullet-proof windows in real life are really just 'bullet-resistant'. After several rounds they will give way. And so they should in the simulation.

peppering a helicopters fuselage with bullets (even up to 20mm for some helicopters) is not going to cause much damage, you have to go for the vital parts such as the main or anti-torque rotors but considering that this is a simulator and that reality is really hard to mimic then maybe faring at the fuselage actually dose something i don't know

by the way BloonerNL i have found that even though the windows of the Ka-60 are bulletproof the doors and framework is not. i fired a couple of rounds into the door and the pilot was dead, kind of weird that the windows are 100% bullet proof but the doors provide almost no protection.

ifrit takes less hits than the ah-9? madness

So does a (any) heli have a damage model? Hitboxes? Hitpoints? Armor? Durability? Or maybe nothing at all?

I want to see the devs explaining how the damage (if any) is supposed to work.

Ka-60 is especially resistant to 7.62 miniguns. Three AI minigun boats needed 14 minutes (!) to bring me down, while I was hovering 100m away, with the tail towards them, to protect the crew, who is rather vulnerable to being killed. Three Hunters HMG took me out reasonably sooner in the same situation.

While dogfighting the KA-60 from an AH-9, I needed almost 3000 bullets to disable its engine. Most of them were on target, as I was shooting at point blank and saw the hits.

What is even more interesting, I never saw any HULL damage on Ka-60, only rotors, engine and sometimes instruments. Most often I was shot down because the crew was killed, rather than the aircraft was disabled.

Ka-60 is a civilian helicopter, only adapted to perform combat missions. Even if it had some kind of armor fitted, it shouldn't be too tough. Think UH-1 here.

Ezcoo added a subscriber: Ezcoo.May 7 2016, 11:19 AM
Ezcoo added a comment.Apr 19 2013, 3:05 PM

Agreed, the KA-60 seems to be very resistant against bullets. I got sniped out from pilot seat a time or two though when I was far away from the enemy, so there's a weak point somewhere around the cockpit. Maybe it's the doors.

On the other hand, some parts, especially instruments are very sensitive to collision damage – especially the HUD starts flashing very easily.

This issue was processed by our team and will be looked into. We thank you for your feedback.

Please keep the issue monitored to see when it is fixed.

well the front panel windows seem to be bullet proof, but the side windows (door) is where it isn't, so no big deal there really. The caliber of the rounds obviously matter the most here, the bigger the more damage seeing as it actually has more potential to penetrate light armour. If 696 rounds of 12.7mm is what it took to take down the KA-60, then i agree it is a bit too powerfull. I can understand that if it was small arms up to 7.6mm though.

I am with tree hugger here on a brief explanation or presentation from BIS to see how vehicles hitpoints/hitboxes armour etc work? Because I have logged a ticket for armoured vehicles like Hunter and ifrit that go up in flames when shot up with small arms. MATV's are suppose to be able to shrug off RPG's and drive away from mine/IED hits, yet it seems awfully weak in game. I dont even know if armour really even plays a role? But none the less, I would like to see and study a presentation of how the damage system on vehicles work, this will be very educational, and I bet many will start finding bugs and stuff to exploit which will lead to patching up before final relaese =)

p00d73 added a subscriber: p00d73.May 7 2016, 11:19 AM

Test results in latest dev build:
Nose and all glass: impervious to everything up to 7.62x51mm. Depending on angle it may even stop .408 or 12.7x99mm.
Lower door: impervious to 5.56mm and 6.5mm from assault rifles. It takes 34 rounds from a 6.5mm LMG, 7 rounds of 7.62x51mm and 1 round of .408 or 12.7x99mm to kill the pilot.

Not only is it near impossible to kill the pilots, the armour of the Ka-60 is inconsistent.